Author Topic: Initial D 4th Stage comments... - Archive Topic (Locked)  (Read 588565 times)

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BNR34GTR

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Re: Initial D 4th Stage comments...
« Reply #1470 on: June 30, 2005, 09:17:42 am »
I don't see how "holding" the subbed versions are going to make any of us cry. I do agree that people shouldn't expect the immediate release of the subs, but like it was said earlier, those idiots are always going to exsist. As far as the intentional holding of the show goes, I'd seem to think that these fan-subbing crews would drive people away by doing that.

I'd love to do the subbing myself, but I'm a little rusty on Japanese, so I can watch the RAWS and get a fairly good idea of what's going, but I do like the way the series has been done by L-E. Perhaps the moral of the story is that if you don't like the series, then don't get involved?

You may think you're getting back at us "IDTards"... But what you are truely doing is showing everyone that today it's Initial D and IDTards that you hate, but tomorrow or the next day it could change. What about when the series ends? Are you going to find some new Anime to rip on and "hold" the subbing of when the idiots set in? What about those people who don't do it, wait paitently, only to be told that there is a intentional hold on it to get back at people. I have never posted complaining about how long it's taking.

But people saying they will intentionally hold the subbing because of other people being idiots makes me wonder about both the morals and maturity of the people involved in that log post. I would also hope that kind of attitude would be frowned on by the people who are seniors in the L-E and IDE groups. If that were to happen with every anime, people might decide to look elsewhere for subs of any anime. I know I would.

 A forum I am part of, www.MX6.com, a forum for Mazda MX-6 owners, recently did banning of some of it's long-time, respected members because of things like that log post. It just goes to show that there are right and wrong ways to conduct yourself when there is the name and reputation of a group on the line. I agree with banning people who can't follow rules, even if it's only a temp-ban. And, it's alot more mature then going ":P We're gonna hold the sub...na nah na nah nah"

I think "donations" could be accepted without attracting attention from the Anime Companies btw. As long as it's clear that you are not rendering a service for money, and it's a person's own will to do said "donations", they cannot say that we are paying you to do it. We would simply be trying to allow you to do a better job by being able to afford better utilities, hosting space, etc.

Sorry for the Rant, and Thank You for the excellent subs of Initial D...

nope-mx3

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Re: Initial D 4th Stage comments...
« Reply #1471 on: June 30, 2005, 09:28:05 am »
I have read over the very intense Post ahead of this..and i have had one question ... and one question only...when will the subs be released usually they try to do it on the same day each month or whatever, just so i have something to look foward to..and btw i leave the bt open for as long as i can just so they don't have to waste to much of there BW.

I don't want this to be rude or whatever someone may take this as, i would just like to have an idea of the releases.. please be kind to this post as it was not noobish/sarcastic/hatefull to any other posts. and i do know this that even though there may be a set date it may not come out on that date WHICH IS FINE BY ME....sigh..i don't know how to not step on anyones toes, and if i can help in any process to help with cost or help with distro/bandwith (bw)/or anything else please let me know.

|EVIL|DoW

Why dont you understand?
Now we probably have to wait even longer....
The subs are out when they are out. Deal with it.

nope-mx3

Offline JC

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Re: Initial D 4th Stage comments...
« Reply #1472 on: June 30, 2005, 10:03:53 am »
God I just love all this bickering and squabbling about something as trivial as people not reading the topic, or just not understanding some general things about the way some groups work. I honestly now believe that it's a waste of time, resources (IE, power), and patience to abuse each other for peoples inability to read and comprehend plain and simple English. You could have this "DON'T ASK THEM WHEN IT'LL BE OUT" in neon fucking pink flashing writing at the top of the screen flashing so fast it send you either epileptic or blind!

At the end of the day, there is always going to be one or two idiots to spoil the whole fucking thing for everyone else, and they know who they are, because they either do it for fun, are the sort of person who has to do something they're told not to to see what happens, or genuinely don't know the way things work (usually because they're the second group who don't READ)

Yes, usually I'm quite calm and collected, and I don't use dodgy French in my posts, but I'm tired, had a really long day at work, and coming home to even more immaturity and stupidity that I could understand coming from my 6 year old brother... Really pisses me the hell off!

And as for the guys from L-E, hold it back for as long as you deem suitable, lose fans, whatever it may take to get most of the message across to people. I'm still going to wait quite patiently for your excellent work, and possibly even contribute online hardware and funding via alternative methods to the cause in a few weeks time.

Reason: Because they fucking well deserve free shit for the job they do!

(pardon the French)
"Better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven" - John Milton, Paradise Lost

Entropicity

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Re: Initial D 4th Stage comments...
« Reply #1473 on: June 30, 2005, 02:57:25 pm »
Hi there

I've been lurking in these forums for a long time.

However the events of the past few days has made me decide to post my view on the intentional delay issue.

First of all, thank you LE and IDE for the excellent fansubs! I throughly enjoy them, even the Karaoke style opening and closing :D

However, I think all these threats about delaying the subs from coming out are nonsensical and uncalled for. Just because some noob logs on for the first time and asks for the episodes isnt cause to punish the entire fansub community by delaying the subs.

Many of us are not kids, and we need not be treated like so. What does delaying subs do? It simply shows that pride is beginning to surface amongst some of the LE people. Just by making fansubs that people enjoy doesnt make you their Lord and Ruler. I understand you may be frustrated that some people do not understand the time and effort needed to produce such excellent fansubs however this doesnt give you the power to threaten a delay.

I find it disheartening that some people have stooped to almost bootlicking proportions to placate LE and sooth LE's anger at noobs who demand subs. LE are not your gods, if LE wasnt doing subs, someone else would be.

LE please do not fall into the trap that is called pride. While we respect your abilities to turn out great fansubs, many of us also notice a certain proudness growing from within. By all means take the time you need to churn out the fansubs but do not judge or punish those who do not recognize the effort needed. Continuously threatening delays only reinforces the impression of arrogance on your part. So just bring on the fansubs at your own time and ignore the unreasonable demands of noobs, they are this way because they enjoy your fansubs too but are not tactful in their haste to get more of the good stuff from LE.

Just remember, LE is only as big as the fans. Without people who download your fansubs, you are nothing.

Thanks for reading my rant. Once again thanks for the fansubs.

angelan

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Re: Initial D 4th Stage comments...
« Reply #1474 on: June 30, 2005, 03:37:50 pm »
okay i felt the need to step in.  Dispite my taking a break from the QC team at live evil (i now work 8 hours a day, drive 3 hours, sleep 8 hours) Adding it up, it doesn't leave me very much time when my parents would also appreciate the fact that I spend SOME time with them. 

That was just an example of how my life, cut short my time to help L-E. 

When push comes to shove, each member of L-E has a life outside of fan subbing.  We do not book off ourselves to do Initial D or any other "high profile" show.  If it so happens that all of us happened to have computer failures, or "happen" to have exams around the same time.  Please.  Don't complain that it took us 1 month for one release, and 1 week for another.  If we felt like pulling together, stay up late, and decide to try and truck out ID4 in time for new years, it's a bonus to us, when fans are happily surprised to find ID4 subbed in time for new years (or was it Christmas, i don't remember).

The "warning to hold" a series is not new.  For those of you who have been around, you'd know that.  And you'd also know that this is not normally the case.  People at L-E may be ready to pounce on me as I say this, but most of the time it's scare tactic.  It's also a way to get noobs off our back.  If you visit our channel regularly, you would see that we actually have an unofficial noob sweep team.  We might as well name them that.  How often have you heard our reasons for the delay as: computer failure on the encoder's side, lost of the translation file due to other computer failures, etc, etc.  Noobs could care less about these reasons (many of these reasons have been the real reasons for previous releases of ID4).  Because the often sarcastic tone of "we'll hold the release" will be enough to calm noobs down, we kept using it.  However, I guess our ID "fans" can no longer be scared.  It's sad really for this to finally blow up like it has for the last two episodes of this stage.  Remember people.  The team has been dealing with this now for OVER a year.  To call them IDtards is a label....just like noob, or narutard. 

Also, note that Live-Evil doesn't JUST do releases for ID4.  They have other releases that have been waiting longer than a month to get out.  Do you not think that it's only fair to queue those out as well, rather than always giving ID4 priority?  Like Gumb said, Sailor moon has been worked on for 8 months!!! Dispite not liking live-action or sailor moon much, we work on it anyway.   We're not in it for the business aspect of it all.  We don't have a download quota to meet each month, most of the time we also don't prioritize a series by it's popularity in the market. 

Once again, we suggest that you go out and get other versions of subs.  Over the year and a half that this series has been chugging out, many other fan subs HAVE put out subs for ID4 as well.  If you really NEED to get the stuff NOW...go look them up.  None of us will blame you or ban you from downloading our stuff.  We can't get it out before they do, that's our problem.  We lose "market share" that's our fault.  Is it our obligation to meet a deadline set by fans? no.  Theres a reason why ID4 is released in japan every 2 months, so why can't we be cut some slack for doing fan subs in a month? Jus because other people do it quicker, doesn't mean we must conform. 

Just think about some of these things.  Give us new ideas to turn noobs away next time they ask us.  Draw up a top 100 effective things to do when noobs ask when the next release is, whatever you want. 

Supra_Saiyan

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Re: Initial D 4th Stage comments...
« Reply #1475 on: June 30, 2005, 03:50:01 pm »
okay i felt the need to step in.  Dispite my taking a break from the QC team at live evil (i now work 8 hours a day, drive 3 hours, sleep 8 hours) Adding it up, it doesn't leave me very much time when my parents would also appreciate the fact that I spend SOME time with them. 

That was just an example of how my life, cut short my time to help L-E. 

When push comes to shove, each member of L-E has a life outside of fan subbing.  We do not book off ourselves to do Initial D or any other "high profile" show.  If it so happens that all of us happened to have computer failures, or "happen" to have exams around the same time.  Please.  Don't complain that it took us 1 month for one release, and 1 week for another.  If we felt like pulling together, stay up late, and decide to try and truck out ID4 in time for new years, it's a bonus to us, when fans are happily surprised to find ID4 subbed in time for new years (or was it Christmas, i don't remember).

The "warning to hold" a series is not new.  For those of you who have been around, you'd know that.  And you'd also know that this is not normally the case.  People at L-E may be ready to pounce on me as I say this, but most of the time it's scare tactic.  It's also a way to get noobs off our back.  If you visit our channel regularly, you would see that we actually have an unofficial noob sweep team.  We might as well name them that.  How often have you heard our reasons for the delay as: computer failure on the encoder's side, lost of the translation file due to other computer failures, etc, etc.  Noobs could care less about these reasons (many of these reasons have been the real reasons for previous releases of ID4).  Because the often sarcastic tone of "we'll hold the release" will be enough to calm noobs down, we kept using it.  However, I guess our ID "fans" can no longer be scared.  It's sad really for this to finally blow up like it has for the last two episodes of this stage.  Remember people.  The team has been dealing with this now for OVER a year.  To call them IDtards is a label....just like noob, or narutard. 

Also, note that Live-Evil doesn't JUST do releases for ID4.  They have other releases that have been waiting longer than a month to get out.  Do you not think that it's only fair to queue those out as well, rather than always giving ID4 priority?  Like Gumb said, Sailor moon has been worked on for 8 months!!! Dispite not liking live-action or sailor moon much, we work on it anyway.   We're not in it for the business aspect of it all.  We don't have a download quota to meet each month, most of the time we also don't prioritize a series by it's popularity in the market. 

Once again, we suggest that you go out and get other versions of subs.  Over the year and a half that this series has been chugging out, many other fan subs HAVE put out subs for ID4 as well.  If you really NEED to get the stuff NOW...go look them up.  None of us will blame you or ban you from downloading our stuff.  We can't get it out before they do, that's our problem.  We lose "market share" that's our fault.  Is it our obligation to meet a deadline set by fans? no.  Theres a reason why ID4 is released in japan every 2 months, so why can't we be cut some slack for doing fan subs in a month? Jus because other people do it quicker, doesn't mean we must conform. 

Just think about some of these things.  Give us new ideas to turn noobs away next time they ask us.  Draw up a top 100 effective things to do when noobs ask when the next release is, whatever you want. 

despite ;)

It seems we sort of do have a "monopoly"

Morphic8

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Re: Initial D 4th Stage comments...
« Reply #1476 on: June 30, 2005, 06:36:38 pm »
I didn't mean for my post to start an uproar. But I do agree with what Angelan said.  And I wasn't originally going against that.  Believe me, i know those things can happen...i have one vid file on my computer, that works fine on my roomates, but crashes mine if i try to open it.  Wierd things happen.   Files become corrupt.   It's just how it is.  But instead of saying, n00bs are pissing us off, we're delaying it, say, we're having some technical difficulties, bear with us, or we all have exams right now.  I also know how that is.  There are was of explaining is so that people will not ask a million questions, or cover up 2 and half pages ranting about why not to delay something.  I don't consider myself old at all (21)...but I do feel that sometimes, i am lightyears ahead in maturity with alot of the people in this community.  I deal with getting a quality product to customers everyday, and if there is a delay, the profressional thing to do, is to tell them.  I work in a printshop, and printers and computers do not always agree, so there are alot of techincal problems that i run into.  but you just have to face it, and say i'm workin on it.  I have nothing against the L-E team, or their work.  Most of what i've been talking about, isn't always about them, it's really a generalization of how things seem to run with fan-subbing groups. 

now on that note, i think we should just end this topic, and really go back to the topic at hand, which is the show itself

Offline gumbaloom

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Re: Initial D 4th Stage comments...
« Reply #1477 on: June 30, 2005, 06:39:36 pm »
Hi there

I've been lurking in these forums for a long time.

However the events of the past few days has made me decide to post my view on the intentional delay issue.

First of all, thank you LE and IDE for the excellent fansubs! I throughly enjoy them, even the Karaoke style opening and closing :D

However, I think all these threats about delaying the subs from coming out are nonsensical and uncalled for. Just because some noob logs on for the first time and asks for the episodes isnt cause to punish the entire fansub community by delaying the subs.

Many of us are not kids, and we need not be treated like so. What does delaying subs do? It simply shows that pride is beginning to surface amongst some of the LE people. Just by making fansubs that people enjoy doesnt make you their Lord and Ruler. I understand you may be frustrated that some people do not understand the time and effort needed to produce such excellent fansubs however this doesnt give you the power to threaten a delay.

I find it disheartening that some people have stooped to almost bootlicking proportions to placate LE and sooth LE's anger at noobs who demand subs. LE are not your gods, if LE wasnt doing subs, someone else would be.

LE please do not fall into the trap that is called pride. While we respect your abilities to turn out great fansubs, many of us also notice a certain proudness growing from within. By all means take the time you need to churn out the fansubs but do not judge or punish those who do not recognize the effort needed. Continuously threatening delays only reinforces the impression of arrogance on your part. So just bring on the fansubs at your own time and ignore the unreasonable demands of noobs, they are this way because they enjoy your fansubs too but are not tactful in their haste to get more of the good stuff from LE.

Just remember, LE is only as big as the fans. Without people who download your fansubs, you are nothing.

Thanks for reading my rant. Once again thanks for the fansubs.

You're missing the point here a little....

A lot of the L-E staff have their computers connected to IRC 24 hours a day 7 days a week. IRC is our primary means of communication and getting the job done. My computer has not been restarted now for 1 week and 5 days. At least for me when I'm fansubbing I normally have mirc open and sub station alpha and I'm constantly switching between the 2. I spend half an hour timing then talk to people for half an hour and answer any pm's I've got.

When I switch back to mirc and the first thing I see is "When is ID4 gonna be out" or some variant it is downright irritating especially when I myself tried to stem the flow of the incessant questions by posting to the L-E home page, earlier in this thread and on IDForums saying words to the effect of "it will take at LEAST a week but possibly longer". However people have chosen to ignore that and warnings in the topic.

Which would you rather us be doing with our free time...fansubbing or answering the same question over and over again.

Let me give you another example..lets say you got a painter in to decorate one of your rooms. Would you be going to him every few minutes asking him when he's gonna be finished? No you wouldn't out of courtesy to him, you'd just leave him to it and let him get on with the job.

We might just be nicks in an IRC channel to you but we're real people heck I've just been at work all day and am sat here typing this post instead of getting on with more important things like timing an ep of a new show that L-E will be doing.

It's dead simple - STOP BUGGING US ABOUT RELEASE DATES!!!. and there wouldnt be a problem.
All that incessant questioning does is
1) Mean we spend less time doing the actual job we're here to do
2) Irritates us because we're answering the same question over and over again.

We're not evil, we're not trying to be sadistic we're just fed up with being bugged all the time. You know ID4 is the ONLY project where we have people bugging us about release dates. Perhaps you should take pity on Cha Cha fans. They've been waiting for the 3rd and final ep of the OVA for nearly a year now. You only have to wait a few weeks. 

Ok heres some hard facts for you.
ID4 ep 15 - The subbing of this ep is pretty far advanced and MIGHT be released soon. However I will NOT say when because I'm not involved in the project.

ID4 ep 16 - This ep hasn't been translated yet.

Now before you all kick off, its because the translator has got real life issues to deal with + work for other projects to deal with. It will be translated when he's got time.

Now I know a certain percentage of the ID fans reading this will say ok cool real life comes first but I know for a fact and as has been demonstrated a certain percentage of the ID fan population will take the view of "why hasn't it been translated ZOMG I NEED MY ID" and think that we should a) force the translator to translate it at virtual gun point b) think we should get another translator or c) think we should use someone elses script. We will resort to none of these solutions and wait till the guy has had time to do translate it.

Now I hope that this bit of information will calm down the whiners and I hope that it will be read in a responsible way. I will also give my personal assurance that anyone who uses the information in an irresponsible way and decides to come and argue the point like "is ep 15 finished yet" or "is ep 16 translated yet" will be kicked and banned so fast you won't know whats hit you. Take this little status update at face value and just wait for the eps to be finished ok?

Regards


gumbaloom
L-E Staffer
[16:35]  <Scaevolus> hey leechers have to expend lots of effort, it takes almost a dozen keystrokes to leech stuff
[16:37]  <Mamo-chan> go stroke goomb's ego plz
[16:38]  <Professor_Goomba> fansubbing is not about leecher ego stroking
[16:38]  <Professor_Goomba> it's about how much we jizz when w

nope-mx3

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Re: Initial D 4th Stage comments...
« Reply #1478 on: June 30, 2005, 07:20:22 pm »
gumbaloon: very good!
Maybe people will get the point if they suddenly looses the right to post here.
It should be a privilege, not a right imho.
That said, I`m used to waiting for shows, and ID4 is definetely worth waiting for.
In my opinion, I think it wouldnt be half as "fun" if the episodes were released every week or something.

By airing two episodes every two months, we can let the excitement build, and think about how things might work out, and when it`s out, its that more interesting to watch.

Now I only hope they`ll air the Movie in Europe (but I doubt it).

nope-mx3

Offline debchan

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Re: Initial D 4th Stage comments...
« Reply #1479 on: June 30, 2005, 07:32:55 pm »
I deal with getting a quality product to customers everyday, and if there is a delay, the profressional thing to do, is to tell them.  I work in a printshop, and printers and computers do not always agree, so there are alot of techincal problems that i run into.  but you just have to face it, and say i'm workin on it.  I have nothing against the L-E team, or their work.  Most of what i've been talking about, isn't always about them, it's really a generalization of how things seem to run with fan-subbing groups. 

The difference here is that your company is selling something.  When people pay for a product, there are certain expectations they have, such as the product will be of a certain quality and it will be in available upon demand. 

However, L-E is not being paid for anything.  The "product" is free of charge.  They have no obligations to meet "customer" expectations and/or demands. 

I don't know why people have such a hard time recognizing this.  Fansub groups don't owe anyone anything, no, not even a time frame for releases. 

angelan

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Re: Initial D 4th Stage comments...
« Reply #1480 on: June 30, 2005, 08:55:59 pm »
Supra_Saiyan, thanks man, for fixing that 1 typo and that one big quote.

Morphic8, you must realize....we tell people that we have lives, that we have other commitments ahead of subbing ID4.  Do they listen? Go through all 99 pages and you'll get the answer to that, and how we feel when for the N-th time, someone asks that very same question.  And I don't use the term noob loosely.  I use it for the people who are impatient and just want the subs NOW NOW NOW.  Please realize that the last few posts have been directed to people who actually spend the time and the brain cells to try and comprehend our situation here.  Hence I explained the whole deal with us having lives, our computers occasionally run into trouble, etc.  But your average noob would not even be bothered to scroll through, let alone read such a long post. 

We explain, people still ask a million questions.  We tell them it's gonna be delayed, they shut up...until now i guess...we found some non-noob fans.  Finally.  ^_*  Please...don't take offense to that, it's a joke. 

I don't consider you old either, as I turned 21 less than a month ago myself.  And to repeat, we're not in this as a business.  Sure we probably owe our faithful, non-noob members good explanation and whatnot, but most don't need it...because they SIMPLY UNDERSTAND.  Just like they say with good friends and enemies.  Your friends don't need explanations and your enemies won't listen anyway.  Same goes for noobs and faithful fans. 

And yes to be honest no one owes anyone anything.  Everyone is welcomed to check out other subs.  To be honest, I checked out some other groups' jobs for two of the eps i think 11 and 12 (don't hold me to it), just for the fun of it, before I got the copy from L-E to QC.  It wasn't a pretty sight...translation wasn't complete, but it was a good hack job. 

Sorry if I seem to be pointing this at you Morphic but it's not, it's for everyone who has the decency to be patient but seems to be starting to forget why we still "torture" them with the wait.

Offline Yoten

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Re: Initial D 4th Stage comments...
« Reply #1481 on: July 01, 2005, 12:46:46 am »
Finally, things are progressing around here. Now I don't have to feel so bad about leaving sarcastic hints as to the situation. :P

Yes, 16 hasn't been translated yet. The delay thing is BS to get people off our backs and, I suspect, a way for them to cover for the fact that it's not done yet. And honestly? Everyone who really gets in a huff over whining ID fans is an L-E member who doesn't have anything to do with the project itself. Funny, that. :P

angelan

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Re: Initial D 4th Stage comments...
« Reply #1482 on: July 01, 2005, 02:35:45 am »
well yoten, that might be cause they're the ones being bugged when they don't have anything to do about it. 

but the people working on it are also waiting for it so they know how the fans sorta feel and have a little more patience.  At least that's me neway =P haha I'm impatient just waiting for the QC version let alone the release =P

Offline tinlunlau

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Re: Initial D 4th Stage comments...
« Reply #1483 on: July 01, 2005, 04:45:21 am »
oy vey.....headache for me to read thru this page.
if they want us to wait, then wait.  you bastards are leeching anyway.  no right to whine.

tesdall

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Re: Initial D 4th Stage comments...
« Reply #1484 on: July 01, 2005, 04:48:22 am »
Why dont you understand?
Now we probably have to wait even longer....
The subs are out when they are out. Deal with it.

nope-mx3

The sad truth is.. i do understand.. i know they will be out when "they are out" but usually a group goes ..we will try to have 1 ep of this show out ...lets say once a month around this date..it would just give me something to look foward to..

it seems your not the person that understands..other wise by reading my post thats all i wanted.. i have tons of anime...from live evil (condor hero, inital d, etc) i love the work as stated...i just wanted a time fram just to have something..not concrete but just ...you do not understand why the heck am i trying to make you understand

|EVIL|DoW