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Messages - cnet128

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Past L-E Projects / Re: Tsubasa Chronicle 2nd Season MASTER THREAD
« on: May 20, 2006, 12:52:00 am »
We're not arguing to 'get anywhere' with the subs, bastard-sama, at the very least I'm not. In fact, I wouldn't even call what I'm doing arguing (well, I guess this post could be called arguing...but I would prefer not to think of it that way, it sounds so uncivilised). It's more I'm just trying to get my honest opinions across on a seemingly controversial issue.

If we annoyed you by making long posts, then I apologise, I guess :-\ Although, isn't that really what forums are for? The entire purpose of forums, as far as I'm aware, is to provide discussion, which people can enjoy. I'd like to think long posts are a healthy and integral part of that.

Even if people 'will flame other people whether you like it or not', it still makes for stimulating discussion and does make a small difference in the community to discuss these issues and try to resolve them.

Then again, if you live up to your name as much as people say, maybe issues appeal to you more than resolution...in which case I apologise for ruining a perfectly bad discussion with positive input ;)

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Past L-E Projects / Re: Tsubasa Chronicle 2nd Season MASTER THREAD
« on: May 19, 2006, 06:47:06 pm »
I endorse the above post. (EDIT: at the bottom of the previous page ¬_¬)

And Suzumiya Haruhi no Yuuutsu is brilliance :D Though I've only so far found time to watch the first two episodes >.< Must...watch...more...

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Past L-E Projects / Re: Tsubasa Chronicle 2nd Season MASTER THREAD
« on: May 18, 2006, 11:35:55 pm »
If a person only watches one anime, and an extremely popular one at that, then it might be fair to patronise them a little, particularly if they, for instance, try to put across opinions that extend clearly beyond their limited experience.

Note, however, that just watching one anime doesn't make the person closed-minded or a fanboy - after all, an interest in one anime doesn't obligate a person to go out and watch more; heck, some people might not have the time or effort to devote to watching more than one series. All it does is make them a casual viewer at best. It's if they stray into the anime viewing community and start swearing by that anime über alles, whilst retaining their ignorance, that such derogatory names may be justified.

People who take fansubbers for granted and actually complain about releases are a completely different issue (though one that may often coincide due to the fact that both groups are characterised by their ignorance in general). Their arrogance *is* unjustified, and they clearly don't appreciate the subber to the degree that they ought to.

Please note, though, that these people should be distinguished from the sort of people who ask when the next release is coming out, or express impatience, in forums and the like. Neither of these are the same as complaining about the releases, although due to their similarity thereto they're generally seen as bad etiquette. Unlike genuine complaints directed at the subbers, however, these are mistakes easily made by the uninitiated, and don't tend to have arrogance behind them at all. They should be gently reprimanded and forgiven (unless of course the newcomer persists, in which case they can be classified under the 'arrogant' category).

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Past L-E Projects / Re: Tsubasa Chronicle 2nd Season MASTER THREAD
« on: May 18, 2006, 06:57:52 pm »
I've just registered for the sake of giving my input on this apparently somewhat controversial issue.

Let's clarify my position here: I'm a Tsubasa fan. I got introduced through the animé; I heard good things about the first series, downloaded it (from various subbers, actually; I'm pretty sure a lot of them were from Live-Evil, but not all). I have little if any 'subber loyalty', I'm afraid, and it's rare that I'll try out an animé because a subber I like is doing it; rather I'll download animé that I hear good things about from whoever's subbing it. (The exception is the first few series I watched; the animé that really started my addiction was Bleach, and I ended up getting into Suzuka and Mizuiro Jidai because Lunar were subbing them as well.)

But I digress. I'm a Tsubasa fan; I've watched the first season of the animé, and I've read scanlations of the manga, and enjoyed both. I'm not what you'd call a CLAMP fan, but I have some experience; I watched and enjoyed the dub of Card Captor Sakura (shudder) before I ever got into animé, and I've read a little of its manga. I've also read the Chobits manga, and seen the OVA of Magic Knight Rayearth. Before Tsubasa, that was the extent of my CLAMP knowledge. Since getting into Tsubasa, I've also got into xxxHOLiC (manga and animé) and I picked up the first volume of CLAMP School Detectives from my local library, which I enjoyed.

At any rate, I'm downloading the second Tsubasa season from Live-Evil because they're subbing it; I currently have no particular intention to watch any of Live-Evil's other series. I appreciate the work that subbers put into making these animé available for us to watch, of course, and for free to boot, but that doesn't mean I feel any personal obligation to any particular fansub group. I watch plenty of other animé from other groups, both unlicensed and (shockingly) licensed, if only because I can't bring myself to give up animé that I've got into once they become licensed.

My take on the semi-animosity in this thread is that most sides are being perfectly reasonable, and there's really very little reason for the animosity. The people who are complaining about the late releases are, when it comes down to it, just naïvely putting into words the thoughts that a lot of people here have but know better than or are too polite to say. Like it or not, when a group commits itself to speed-subbing a show, especially one with the level of guaranteed popularity that Tsubasa has, fans are going to be impatient to see the next episode; in fact, this goes for ANY show, it's just that the larger the audience of the show is, the more people are going to feel that way, and the more evident it will be as a result.

Of course, it's nobody's fault; the subbers aren't somehow 'wrong' for not managing to release all their shows as fast as the fans can watch them, and the fans aren't 'wrong' for wanting to see the episodes (...and nor are those who voice their queries as to when episodes will be released; they just don't know any better). Nor, for that matter, are the original animators and publishers 'wrong' for only showing episodes once a week. It's just the way it works.

Now for the argument about the quality of the animé. Personally, I have numerous reasons for watching any animé. Firstly, because I like its original concept: in Tsubasa Chronicle's case, this was a given because it featured characters I already know and like in settings that looked appealing. Secondly, because it has a good reputation: well, that's a given for Tsubasa too, I hear plenty of good things about it, and it has tons of fans.

And thirdly, because I can get hold of it easily. This is the kicker: if I know perfectly well that a show is going to be diffiicult to get hold of regularly, then it's unlikely I'm going to start watching it. There are a few exceptions; I may download series or OVAs that I'm very interested in and can get hold of in one batch even if they are hard to get hold of (Boku wa Imouto ni Koi wo Suru, for example, an OVA that ironically ended up getting me into its extremely slow-to-be-scanlated manga :p), but an ongoing series that is released very slowly isn't something I'm likely to get into unless I'm extremely interested in it beforehand. Not because I wouldn't necessarily be interested in watching it...but because I don't have time (or disk space ;)) to watch every single animé I'd be interested in watching (heck, the number I'm trying to get through at the moment is pushing it), and since I have so many animé to choose from, I'm not going to unnecessarily trouble myself by introducing myself to a series that's going to end up frustrating me with slow releases when I could just as easily pick up a series that's going to release regularly or is already finished and available to watch.

As for Tsubasa specifically, I think it is one of the better animé that I watch at the moment. It doesn't have the intricate and gripping central storyline that manages to advance every episode and leave you wanting more, like some shows (*cough*Blood+*cough*), but it's probably the best feel-good animé I've ever watched. With a huge cast of extremely endearing characters, good pace to its episodes, an intriguing overhanging central storyline, and beautiful animation and music, it's just one of those shows you can let wash over you and enjoy it, and there's never an episode that fails to leave me with a warm feeling afterwards. There's just something perfect and satisfying about it.

Also, when it does use fillers, they seem to be single episodes, which fit in well with the rest of the show. Heck, I hardly even noticed the filler in the first season (which I watched before reading the manga); I think there were three episodes that actually made me think 'hmm, this might be filler...', all of which were good episodes anyway, and one of which wasn't filler at all. Episode 4, "Innocent Wanderer" was so well-executed that it didn't even cross my mind that it was filler when I originally watched it.

Overall, I think that the only thing that's at all unreasonable here is the people implying that there's something wrong with watching Tsubasa and not watching L-E's less popular releases. Because I, and I'm sure plenty of other people who watch Tsubasa, don't have time to watch every animé in existence, and though I'm sure the praise of the people who do watch the series is justified, there are a TON of good series out there. If I tried to watch every episode of every animé released by every fansub group I download from, I'd enjoy them all, I don't doubt, but I wouldn't have time to eat, work or sleep, either, never mind keep track of them all ;).

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